Examining Prime-legal legacy armies and my collection, Part 2

Continuing from yesterday, I am going to look at the remaining Prime-legal legacy armies, and try to figure out where I stand with each of them.  This will help guide my purchases before the rules come out, and give me some idea of what to expect.

One thing to note is that when I count units, I'm really counting MK3 units- sometimes this will actually translate to more MKIV units than I have listed, but I can't know that for sure until the rules come out.

Mercenary (Blindwater, Cephalyx, Farrow, Privateer, Rhulic, and Steelhead):

Quite a lot of armies here!  Blindwater I am well set on- I own plenty of beasts, units, warlocks, and solos. I expect I will be able to be able to put this army on the table from day one.

For Cephalyx, I have one warcaster (Exulon Thexus), a unit of Mind Benders, a unit of Overlords, an Agitator solo, and a Dominator UA.  Depending on how the Dominator ends up, maybe that will become another unit.  Clearly, I need some Monstrosities.  Even with them, it would be a stretch to play this army for a bit.

I had been slowly getting into Farrow, but my collection is pretty sparse.  I should have most of the warlocks, at least, as well as five beasts (although two are Razor Boars), a unit of Brigands, a unit of Valkyries, and a good number of solos.  Honestly, I might just be a few units away from this being playable.

I own almost nothing for Privateers.  I would have to buy this army from scratch.

I think I should be well set up for Rhulic at least.  Two warcasters, ten warjacks, five units, and almost all of the relevant solos.  I might actually be close to full Field Allowance for Rhul, honestly.

Finally, Steelheads are not in a great place.  I assume Damiano will be one of the casters, and I own him.  I can only guess on the warjacks.  I own a unit of Heavy Cavalry and a Mortar, and I'd have to guess on the solos (I own no solos with 'Steelhead' in the name though).  Not quite starting from nothing, but I'm not very far along, either.

Protectorate of Menoth (Exemplar and Flameguard):

Based on the current beta rules for the Exemplar army, I can field 75 points.  If that ends up being the standard point level, great!  If the standard is 100... well, I'll have some buying to do (although Mercenaries and Cadres may help me out here).

For Flameguard, I do not own a relevant unit or solo.  Yet another army I would have to build from scratch if I wanted to play it :(.

Retribution (Dawnguard and Mage Hunter):

I do own two units of Dawnguard Invictors (which will become 3-4 units in MKIV).  Hard to say which jacks will make the jump, although I expect Imperatus will, and I do own him.  Therefore, at a minimum, I expect I will be able to field a small, very specific, army for Dawnguard.

The story for Mage Hunters is much worse.  I own a couple of relevant solos, but I don't own any of the units.  Yet ANOTHER army I would have to build from scratch, sadly.

Skorne (Immortals and Praetorians):

I own a minimum unit of Immortals, most of the Immortal related solos, and likely, whatever beasts and warlocks they decide to include.  So this would involve just a few unit purchases. 

The news for Praetorians is better- I own a unit of Swordsmen, a unit of Keltarii, a minimum unit of Ferox (which will likely just be a unit in MKIV).  Solos would be a guess, along with beasts, but I strongly suspect I can play the Praetorian army the day they release rules for them.

Trollbloods (Northkin and United Kriel):

I own almost nothing for Trollbloods, so unfortunately, both of these armies would involve significant purchasing to become playable.

There is a chance I will see at least some of my collection become cadres that some of these armies can take, so there is hope that I'll have a bit more flexibility than I've listed.

In summary, the news is not as good as I would like (the result of spreading out how I purchased things over the last couple of years instead of focusing), but I will have plenty of choices going into MKIV, at least.  In addition, since I will buy into a few of the new armies, I won't have to worry about when things rotate into Unlimited.

Now, back to waiting for my battle-boxes to arrive...

Examining what the Prime-legal Legacy armies mean to me

With the list of 28 Prime-legal Legacy armies released last week, I have been trying to figure out what I can expect for my own collection, personally.  Maybe get an idea of what I should try to buy so I can get some games pretty early into MKIV.

Circle (Blackclad and Tharn):

I'm not sure where they will go with the Blackclad army.  The current 'Blackclad Theme' is Secret Masters, and I cannot really see that being ported the way it is (a Minion-focused Circle army?).  Maybe when they release the cadre rules, this will have some ways to interact with them.  I just don't know what to expect from this one.  I *think* this might be a Blackclad/Wold theme, but I can’t be sure.  Either way... I own a decent selection of Blackclad models (a unit of Druids, a unit of Mist Riders, various solos and warlocks).  However, without knowing more about this one, I just can't guess what I would need to field.

For Tharn, I own quite a number of relevant units and solos (as in eight Tharn units and five Tharn solos).  I would guess the living beasts would go into this theme, because they'll need some beasts, and I have plenty of those, too.  I would guess Kromac and Iona as warlocks... neither of which I own.  Aside from that, I think I'm well positioned to play Tharn right out of the gate.

Convergence (single army):

I own three warcasters... 3 non-colossal warjacks (we know colossals are not going to be usable right away), two units (assuming Asphyxious4 is Prime-legal), and about seven solos.  I *think* I will be able to play Convergence, or at a minimum, I will be one or two purchases from having them playable.  They will not be good... but if I can put them on the table, I can work on the quality of my choices later.

Crucible Guard (single army):

I should have this playable right from the get-go, with quite a number of choices.  To play 100 points (which may be the standard), I would have to buy one more warjack.  Easy enough.

Cryx (Bane and Blackfleet):

For the Bane army, where we've seen Beta rules, I can currently field 298 points.  I'm good, here, with lots of options available (and both warcasters listed playable).

Blackfleet is harder to say.  If they just take the Scourge of the Broken Coast theme, and stop there, I may not have enough to play.  A unit of Boarding Party, a unit of Ironmongers, a unit of Bloodgorgers... and maybe a bunch of solos.  If they include the Ghost Fleet items, I can add a unit of Revenant Crew.  Really should have bought Satyxis over all of these years, I just haven't gotten around to it yet.  So... yeah, may not be able to field these guys for a while.

Cygnar (Storm Knight and Trencher):

For Storm Knights, I should have a few relevant casters, a few relevant jacks, and I own two units of Stormblade Infantry, one of Stormguards, and a bunch of random solos.  I probably will be okay.  Maybe I need to buy some Storm Lances.

For Trenchers... I'm going to have to hope to get lucky on the warjack choices, to start with.  I own an Express Team and a unit of Trenchers, and very few solos.  Once again, might be tough to field these guys to start with.

Grymkin (single army):

I have been buying some Grymkin all year.  I have a pretty good collection, and I expect I'll be able to field them the day they get rules.

Infernals (single army):

I am not quite sure how they'll make this work out, but I do have a good collection of Infernals, and should be okay playing them immediately.  I may want to pick up a unit of Howlers, however.

Khador (Man-O-War and Winter Guard):

I really have nothing for Man-o-War.  Thankfully, two people in my playgroup do, so at least we'll be able to see them on the table.

I'm still surprised they are having Winter Guard as one of the Prime-legal armies, given the upcoming Winter Korps.  Baffling.  Anyway, I have some relevant models here - a Field Gun, a Mortar crew, a unit of Winter Guard Infantry, and Kovnik Joe.  Depending on what else is included (for instance, I have a decent number of Widowmakers), I might be okay here.  Probably playable.

Legion (Blighted Nyss and Blighted Ogrun):

I'm covered on warlocks for both of these, I think, and I'm probably going to be okay on the warbeasts (although I admit I do not own any of the character warbeasts).  For the Nyss, I own a unit of Archers/Swordsmen (unassembled, so one or the other), a unit of Blightblades and maybe a few solos.  Not promising.

Blighted Ogrun are even worse- a unit of Warmongers and a unit of Warspears.  No solos.  I might have a hard time putting any Legion on the table in Mark IV without buying quite a bit more.  Damn.

That's probably good for the moment, I'll think about the rest of my collection and how they relate to MKIV armies tomorrow.

PP releases actual list of Legacy armies!

Heh, got my post out JUST IN TIME to be irrelevant.  Here's the official list of legacy armies that will be Prime legal to start with: https://home.privateerpress.com/2022/08/18/legacy-armies-in-prime-arena/

I was right and wrong.  Some of these are a bit baffling to me (Winter Guard and Storm Knights?  We have new armies for those), some of these are obvious (how did I forget about Steelheads?), but hey, at least now we know!

Warmachine MKIV: Thinking about Legacy armies

(Image from Privateer Press' website)

There’s nothing like the long wait between and announcement of a new edition, and the long gap until getting it, or at least getting enough new info to talk more about it.  I placed my order for the new preview battlegroups... but they mention they are just now starting to ship them, so who knows how long until mine arrive. 

Privateer Press released their most recent Primecast+ yesterday, with renders of new Khador models (they look great!), and released an article about the process they use when making resin models, and safety tips.  People interested in this game have probably already seen those though.

Since I have some time before new stuff arrives at my doorstep, a fun way to spend the time might be to look at what armies will be legal in the Prime format.  We know that every current army will get at least one (and likely two) Prime legal armies in time, and we did receive some information as to what some of those would be, but with a lack of other things to talk about for the moment, let's take a look at each faction, and come up with some ideas.

I am basing my guesses on a few factors.  Things that are iconic for a faction, armies with new releases, and which themes PP has already mentioned.  I also think the warjacks and warbeasts will have to exist in more than one army, because I do not think there are enough unique jacks to create significant disparate groupings of warjacks.  To me, this lowers the chance of seeing jack or warbeast focused armies (except in some cases, like the mini-factions).

Circle Orboros

I feel like the way armies are being split now, the Mercenary/Minion focused themes aren't making the transition as is (although, we'll have to see how they implement Mercenaries and Minions in MKIV before we'll know for sure).  The most iconic and unique themes in Circle are probably Devourer's Host (Tharn) and Bones of Orboros (Wolds), and Devourer's Host, I believe, has the most recent set of new releases.  So my guess for Prime-legal armies: Tharn and Wolds.

Convergence of Cyriss

We have heard from both the August Primecast and from various posts on social media that the various mini-factions should be completely Prime Legal.  Convergence is the biggest of these mini-factions, but I don't think it is unreasonable we do see all of it make the jump.  I suspect that the Strange Bedfellows theme will not be playable in any form, so my guess for Convergence: Vectors and Infantry armies (essentially the Destruction Initiative and Clockwork Legions themes, as they are).

Crucible Guard

Again, they have mentioned that all of the mini-factions would be prime legal.  I suspect we'll see Crucible Guard just receive a single army containing the entire faction (so basically, what Magnum Opus is right now).

Cryx

I think Dark Host (Banes) and Scourge of the Broken Coast (Satyxis/Scharde/Black Ogrun) will be our Prime-legal choices.  They have released a Bane army as a preview demo army, and I think it's both thematic and iconic, so I think it's likely a Prime choice.  I don't think there are enough jacks that aren't in the Bane army to make for an interesting jack army, meaning the remaining choice is between Scourge and Ghost Fleet.  Both feel iconic and distinct, but Scourge has recent-ish (2018) new releases, and I don't think they want a potentially heavy incorporeal army starting out in Prime. 

Cygnar

Clearly, they are releasing the Storm Legion this year, which will be a purely MKIV army.  I think this probably eliminates Storm Division as a Prime-legal army.  They hint (or outright say) that Gravediggers (Trenchers) will be Prime-legal.  So what does that leave?  Heavy Metal is too jack focused, and I think those are out.  So that leaves Sons of the Tempest or Flames in the Darkness... hmm. Flames has recent releases, which makes it appealing as a choice, but I'm actually going to go with Sons of the Tempest (Gun Mages) here, because it is purely Cygnar, and significantly more iconic for Cygnar as a whole.  So my guesses: Gravediggers (Trenchers) and Sons of the Tempest (Gun Mages).

Grymkin

Again, we're told that the whole faction is making the transition to Prime.  I suspect that we get a single army, including everything in the faction, because I don't think an infantry/beast split into two armies really creates two interesting choices.

Infernals

Our final mini-faction.  Everything is in Prime, and I'm guessing they just get the one army, which is all of the Infernal models, and ignore Hearts of Darkness for purposes of MKIV.

Khador

Winter Korps is one of the early MKIV releases, so I don't see Winter Guard making the jump to prime.  Privateer Press has also mentioned that Man-O-War would be a Prime legal army. So what would be a likely second legacy army?  I think Flame in the Darkness and Warriors of the Old Faith are probably on the outside looking in, although I think both have merit as being Prime legal armies.  I think their warjack-focused army (Jaws of the Wolf) is out, because they will need the jacks elsewhere. That leaves Legion of Steel (Iron Fang) and Wolves of Winter (Doom Reavers and Greylords), both of which feel possible.  I'll lean slightly towards Legion of Steel.  They feel more focused thematically, and they provide a very different look to anything else that would be Prime Legal, so I think they are a good choice.

Legion of Everblight

I think Primal Terrors (Blighted Ogrun) are a shoe-in, given the recent-ish releases, and self-contained theme.  Using all of my guesses from above, I think we can assume Oracles of Annihilation will be out, because of the Minions.  Ravens of War doesn't feel terribly cohesive to me, so I think we are going to see Children of the Dragon (Nyss), which also have the benefit of including the Virtues, another recent Legion release.

Mercenaries

Privateer Press did give us some information here in the recent Primecast.  Rhul, Cephalyx, and Pirates will have Prime legal armies.  What about the other themes?  I actually think Flames in the Darkness has a shot here- because we don't care about the origin Factions anymore, I think they'll move everything into a Flames in the Darkness Army (and give it the Mercenary Faction, because why not?).  There are lot of recent releases, and they can keep it pretty tight and interesting.  The other themes don't feel like locks to me, so I think that is all we'll see.

Minions

I believe they have mentioned that Farrow and Gators would have prime legal armies, and I don't think we'll see anything more than that.  Will Work for Food feels too general, and Vengeance of Dhunia feels like it'd be more likely a Trollblood army.

Protectorate of Menoth

We have received the beta rules for an Exemplar force, and I think that sticks into Prime.  For a second army, I cannot see Creator's Might (warjacks) for reasons stated above.  Guardians of the Temple (Flameguard) has potential, but instead I'm going to guess that we will see Faithful Masses (Paladins + the random faithful).  I think this has the benefit of covering a lot of random models, and may actually be representative of what the Protectorate's remaining forces look like (whereas I think the Flameguard fought the Exemplars and lost).

Retribution of Scyrah

Well, they aren't going to be around in MKIV anymore (replaced by Dusk), so Retribution shows an interesting case- any Prime armies here won't be replaced by new armies, but instead, just rotated out someday.  Kind of a sad ending for the Iosans.

For MKIV armies, I think we get the Legions of Dawn (Dawnguard).  They are still active in the background, with Vyros founding a colony north of Rhul, if I remember the IKRPG background correctly.  They are probably a shadow of themselves, but they do have a cohesive self-contained army.  My second guess would be Defenders of Ios.  These again, I think, are at least partially active in the current world (as part of the previously mentioned colony), but they've also received a few new releases (the House Ellowuyr models), which would make them appealing to keep active.

Skorne

My guess here is Exalted (Immortals) and Masters of War (Cataphracts and Praetorians).  I am tempted to just have Cataphracts be the army, but they don't have enough choices to be on their own, really, and I think even though there are enough Praetorians to be their own army, they just aren't visually interesting enough on their own to be the choice.  Immortals have had recent releases, and have a Battle Engine PP would be happy to sell more of, so I think they are definitely in.  

Trollbloods

I think Storm of the North is a shoe-in, given that they had a full release a few years back, and were designed to work together and be a distinct force.  I also think Champions are a fairly iconic Trollblood unit, and you need at least one theme that includes them.

For my second guess, I'd guess Kriel Company, as this catches many of the other models, gives a good mix of infantry units, and plays and looks very different from Storm of the North.

 

Anyway, eventually we will know for certain what the plan is, but I think these are pretty good guesses.  I'd love to hear your thoughts, especially if you disagree!

Warmachine MKIV Battlegroups available for order!

 

You can now order the preview battlegroups from Privateer Press' webstore!  Khador, Cygnar, and Orgoth.

Yes, I ordered at least one.  I can't deny I may have ordered all three.  What did you expect?

A bunch of Privateer Press/Warmachine news and updates

Well, PP isn't wasting any time with more MKIV news/previews and information.

A lore overview of the new Dusk faction (and House Kallyss army)

I would've preferred basically ANY art associated with it.  Give me a damn solo, or something.  This is fine, but come on- we want game-related information.

For instance, this is more like it

Some models for the new Khador Winter Corps army, some lore, and some rule hints.  A few interesting things coming out of this article.

Kapitan Ekaterina Baranova is going to give arc nodes to all of her jacks?  Khador with arc nodes?  Are you crazy?  That's amazing.  ESPECIALLY with the current way arc nodes stand, and the ability to give one of your jacks Unstoppable (with the Break Through command card), if you need to... this is going to make Khador very scary in the arcane game.  Plus, her feat could stock her up with focus.  She's going to be amazing, I think.

Dire Wolf looks amazing, of course.  The fastest Khador warjack ever built sounds great (EYE ROLL).  Just what I need, more Khador jacks in my face.  I'm glad they didn't give Khador a light, just to keep that thematic part of Khador around.  And hey, who doesn't love a Shield Guard?

The Great Bear looks fine... kind of just feels like a Mk3 Khador heavy, to be honest.  We'll have to see how it works with the weapon options.

And we see the full contents of the first to starter armies

So, for the Orgoth, that's a caster, a light jack, a heavy jack, 4 units, and a solo (plus various options).  Two hundred dollars is certainly a big ask to start with, but I tried throwing together a Crucible Guard equivalent, and came up with about 250 dollars.  The value seems to be there, at least. 

I could see myself grabbing both of these, and then waiting with the next factions, just to let my money catch up.  I already have a color-scheme for the Cygnar that I like (it's orange, I feel like I've put a picture up, somewhere).  For the Orgoth, I'm considering something with blues.  Maybe the US Navy's previous uniforms (the blueberries).

Image from Wikipedia

I'll give it a shot on one of the jack weapons first, and see how I like it, haha.

And now we get this article

Thursday!  Time to order stuff!  I like how the warcaster choice seems to be the Warcaster C one (i.e., not the warcaster in the starter or expansion boxes).  A smart move that won't leave people with bad feelings. 

Anyway, I am going to try to buy all three of the battlegroups, to give my friends and me toys to try out.  I'll work to get them painted quickly, too!  Exciting times for Warmachine!